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Dyncorp should pay the employees they have before hiring more

Will work for moneyMaybe it’s just my crazy way of thinking, but if you have hired someone to work for you….say Dyncorp for example…..don’t you have an obligation to pay them on time and as agree to? And if you don’t, there shouldn’t there be repercussions? I have been getting numerous complaints that Dyncorp seems to be having a problem paying their American employees on time and as agreed to. Some haven’t been paid for as many as two pay periods.  There is no need to go into what I would be doing about that. All I can say is….. I DON’T WORK FOR FREE and I don’t expect anyone else to as well.

Afghanistan contractor numbers expected to increase
Stars and Stripes
European edition, Thursday, December 3, 2009

Even as U.S. troops surge to new highs in Afghanistan they are outnumbered by military contractors, according to a Defense Department census due to be distributed to Congress — illustrating how hard it is for the U.S. to wean itself from the large numbers of war-zone contractors that have proved controversial in Iraq, the Wall Street Journal reported Wednesday.

The number of contractors in Afghanistan rose to almost 74,000 by June 30, outnumbering the roughly 58,000 U.S. soldiers on the ground at that point, the paper noted.

As the military force in Afghanistan grows further, to a planned 68,000 by the end of the year, the Defense Department expects the ranks of contractors to increase more.

The military requires contractors for essential functions ranging from supplying food and laundry services to guarding convoys and even military bases — functions once performed by military personnel but have been outsourced so a slimmed-down military can focus more on battle-related tasks.

The heavy reliance on contractors in Afghanistan signals that a situation that defense planners once considered temporary has become a standard fixture of U.S. military operations, according to the Journal.

“For a sustained fight like our current commitments, the U.S. military can’t go to war without contractors on the battlefield,” Steven Arnold, a former Army general and retired executive at logistics specialists Ecolog USA and KBR Inc., told the Journal. KBR was formerly owned by Halliburton Co. “For that matter, neither can NATO.” (click HERE for original article)

My question is “Are they going to fill those positions with American taxpayers, or foreign nationals?”

Ms Sparky

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  1. Comment by might USA:

    Shame on you, what do you have against them?
    Some of them have better personality than us expats….
    We hate each other, rasist’s……..I really have no comment this time, every second sentence starts with fn or TCN, or SCW…
    Open you eyes, It’s our tax money, that’s true, but KBR is taking people that don’t have skills to read or write their own language, especially new hires, I got two of them age 27 and 34,……….

  2. Comment by gungho:

    Might USA you do not get it at all. If you travel thru Dubai and watch CNN you will see that Macedonia has an advert that says the average wage is 430 euros a month there. They only pay once a month in euope. So there salary is huge compared to ours versus living expenses. Speaking of which, if their gov’t approves the land and house building permit then there is no cost to buy homeownwers insurance. That is a benefit we do not have in the states. Now to the main point, this is being funded by the US so we should come first, second we pay taxes albeit FICA, whatever. Third , our money goes back home does theirs? Yes to Macedonia, Bosnai, UK, Kenya, Sierra Leone. Why does every second sentence start with TCN? Because there are so many of them and they do have mafias and play games and form together to get people fired if they cannot go on RnR at the same time. If there is any racism it is on their part and it wa sexplained to me why. It has to do with the arms embargo back in the civil war. So it is not exactlyracism but not exactly a endearment

    • Comment by Darko:

      Sorry, Gungho… But I disagree with You… I’m a Macedonian and I have worked in the States… I’m sorry to say that I’ve seen more racism there than I’ve imagined(not on my skin, I’m caucasian)… Second, My country currently deploys, as I’ve heard, approx. 4% of total NATO soldiers in Afghanistan… That’s a lot for a country of 2 mil.people like mine is…
      And for why they hire us… Well, we’re known as skilled and highly committed workers..so..

  3. Comment by Neil:

    What crazy comments, I am a Brit who works in Afghanistan for an American company. Maybe because I can do my job 50% better than an American. You see it all the time most of these Jobs are just jobs for the Boys. As hiring friends who do not have a clue what to do ex mil pals etc etc. No matter what the nationality if they can do the job good hire them. I worked for a diff contractor who tried to only employ Americans how did it turn out?? Not good there was not enough qualified people to hire. This is the reason they had to turn to FN’s as you put it. Also being British are we not in this war together. If you put the UK population against yours we have a much larger percentage of troops there. We also pay tax towards the efforts out there. We have as much right to work there as Americans!!

    • Comment by Ms Sparky:

      My tax dollars are paying your salary and your salary is going to Britain. Personally, I don’t think of Brit’s as FN’s. I think of them as members of the coalition. I still believe that Americans should have first shot at the jobs being paid for by US tax dollars.

      Also….there are more than enough Americans to fill the jobs in Afghanistan and Iraq. Many many qualified Americans don’t stay because their personal and professional ethics can’t tolerate the corruption and abuse put out by companies like KBR. They don’t want to be any part of it.

      • Comment by GG:

        I agree with Mrs. Sparky, I work with Macedonians and really like them, but they deduct FICA and Medicade taxes from me and none from them, in essence they get more money to take back to their country and spur their economy. Where is the equal treatment under the law we are fighting for.?????


    • Comment by Baboo Remembers:

      Just as long as your not bootlegging alcohol, as with most of the Brit’s in Dubai.

  4. Comment by CHICK:

    I always was told EXPATS are considered the coalition forces such the Brits and Aussies. I never considered them as FNs and neither did the company when it came to pay. The Brits are lucky they have the pound, the folks that get paid in Euros are lucky as well. The Aussies, I’m sure they’re breaking even such as ourselves. Hell, if your Canadian you’re doing much better than the rest of us!

  5. Comment by Charles M. Smith:

    (note: This comment was left on another Dyncorp wage issues post-so I am cross posting it here too)

    Three points:

    1. Contractually the Government relies on the contractor to manage their workforce. If there are pay issues, that would be between DynCorp and the workers. The contract would not include language on how and when employees are to be paid.

    2. This kind of disruption sounds like it would result in performance failures as workers quit and replacements must be hired, trained and moved into the jobs. Part of the evaluations which won the contract would have been a plan to ensure workforce continuity to avoid such disruption. The performance failures should result in contract enforcement actions, CARS by the ACO or a PCO notice that DynCorp’s failure must be immediately corrected or termination will be considered. These actions would be aimed at the performance failures, not at the pay issue per se. This is one of the points of having three contractors, so you can remove work or default poor performance.

    3. If DynCorp is submitting vouchers for payment under a cost contract which include labor costs incurred and are not really incurring those costs, they have committed fraud, if this is intentional. If it is not intentional, then they must correct the system which has resulted in this overbilling. The Defense Contract Audit Agency should identify this issue and work with the ACO and PCO on corrective action. Generally this would include withholding of a percentage of payments, until the issue is resolved.

    One of the problems may be Contracting Command, Rock Island. These are the same people who prospered by throwing money at KBR to resolve LOGCAP III problems in 2004-2006. I am afraid they learned absolutely the wrong lessons from this period, especially as the Army continues to deny there were any such problems.

    Recent testimony by the Army, DCMA and DCAA (to Congressional Committees and the Wartime Commission, all under oath) has stated that they have sufficient staff to identify early and correct such problems.

  6. Comment by GEORGE:

    Hired on dyn two weeks ago.
    Got paid for the first week on time, at their
    end of the pay period.

    So far, good.


    • Comment by Ms Sparky:

      Thank goodness. Keep us posted. Do you know if the SCW’s are being paid on time. They were supposed to get two debit cards, 1 for them and 1 for their family so they could withdraw pay in their country. Is that happening?

      • Comment by GG:

        Yes their trying. Many cannot fill out a time sheet and do no speak english. Their bank has no bank numbers and /or routing numbers.Their are small problems, but they are getting paid in cash. gg

  7. Comment by Agitato:

    No. Some, but not all, were paid in cash and a rep was elected to come to KAF and Western Union the money.

    DIFZ Expats had a payday yesterday, and many were disappointed to find numerous short-pay issues, erroneous witholding, tax errors, etc.

    We’ve heard about the debit cards for TCN’s, but no one has seen them.

  8. Comment by Baboo Remembers:

    Western Union….I’m going green this year so everyone can give me cash to recycle.
    Merry X-MAS

  9. Comment by DCAA Auditor:

    Just a note – Mr. Smith needs to actually read the contract before making statements. The LCIV contract due to the large amount of funds being paid out allows the contractors to bill the Government when the costs are committed – that means that when somesone submits a timesheet – and is owed a salary then all of the LCVI contractors are able to bill the Government for the cost.

    Also as a side note – there are withholds – and the invoices are audited prior to being paid unlike most contracts.

    Regardless one of the requirements for award of the LCIV Contract was that the companies have sufficient financial stability and resources to allow them to be able to meet obligations prior to payment.

    By the way DCAA will allow a supervisor to complete the timesheet for those who are unable on a daily basis in front of the individual and then the individual and the supervisor – provided they can either speak the persons language or there is a qualified interpreter present must each initial that day’s entries. It has been and is being done that way overseas for years.

    • Comment by Ms Sparky:

      I just want to make sure I’m clear. Are you telling me a LOGCAP IV contractor can be legally reimbursed for payroll expenses that they have not paid out. In other words, if an employee submits a timesheet and is not paid for whatever reason, and the contractor is reimbursed for these wages, that is not fraudulent.

      I also am concerned the DoD does is not taking issue with the large number of Dyncorp employees dmobing due to non payment in Afghanistan. I am talking about American expats not SCW/TCN’s.

      • Comment by Ksniper:

        Sparky who ever this DCCA Auditor is probably a phony knows about the non payment and is sticking his or hers head in the dirt. If you submit your timesheet correctly and on time you should be paid on time. According to the contract you should be either paid biweekly or Monthly when you are not paid the employer is in violation of the contract. DCCA Auditor make sure you are correct when it comes to pay. Not only or the SCW’s are getting run under the bus but so are the expats as well. Hopefully there can be a resolution concerning this.

    • Comment by 2 Cents:

      DCAA Auditor,

      Maybe you should go read the contract. Page 38 Section I, Specifically I-29.

      52.216-7 — Allowable Cost and Payment:

      (b) Reimbursing costs.

      (1) For the purpose of reimbursing allowable costs (except as provided in subparagraph (b)(2) of this clause, with respect to pension, deferred profit sharing, and employee stock ownership plan contributions), the term “costs” includes only —

      (i) Those recorded costs that, at the time of the request for reimbursement, the Contractor has paid by cash, check, or other form of actual payment for items or services purchased directly for the contract;

      (ii) When the Contractor is not delinquent in paying costs of contract performance in the ordinary course of business, costs incurred, but not necessarily paid, for —

      (A) Supplies and services purchased directly for the contract and associated financing payments to subcontractors, provided payments determined due will be made—

      (1) In accordance with the terms and conditions of a subcontract or invoice; and

      (2) Ordinarily within 30 days of the submission of the Contractor’s payment request to the Government;

      (B) Materials issued from the Contractor’s inventory and placed in the production process for use on the contract;

      (C) Direct labor;

      (D) Direct travel;

      (E) Other direct in-house costs; and

      (F) Properly allocable and allowable indirect costs, as shown in the records maintained by the Contractor for purposes of obtaining reimbursement under Government contracts; and

      (iii) The amount of financing payments that have been paid by cash, check or other form of payment to subcontractors.


      So before you make a statement, that someone “needs to actually read the contract before making statements.” Maybe it is time for you to take your own advice.

      After you do that, go ahead and remove your foot and then try again.

      Have a good day.

      • Comment by Ms Sparky:

        Well said. Thank you for this great comment and thanks for backing it up with FACTS.

        Well DCAA Auditor I think the votes are in. And we are calling you on your crap.

        I’m sticking with Charles Smith and 2 Cents comments. It sounds to me like they have read the contract and their comments are most factual.

        So….who are you really?

  10. Comment by Ex-KBR Wife:

    It is sad to see that there are still Dyncorp employees experiencing issues with their paychecks. This should not be happening. How can Dyncorp expect to keep anyone working if they continue to treat their employees this way?? How can Dyncorp keep their current contracts if this is how they do business??? It should be setting off alarms and whistles everywhere that they can not handle this contract!!!! Is anyone in our government listening to what is going on with them????? I don’t know all the in’s and out’s of the contract and really don’t care to learn all of it. The one thing that I do know and so does everyone else is that this is wrong!!!!!!! Dyncorp workers should not have to be begging someone to pay them much less be expected to stay while it continues to happen. I don’t understand how the government can keep paying them knowing all of this is going on.
    H-E-L-L-O!!!!! Is there anybody home in Washington?? Do any of you care that Dyncorp has hired employees under a government contract to support our military and now is not paying them???? It does not look good on the part of our government for this to continue to go on!!!!!

  11. Comment by Charles M. Smith:

    Just a note on this issue of when a contractor can bill for costs. FAR 52.216-7 — Allowable Cost and Payment (cited above) is the standard clause for this contract. I am not aware of any non-standard arrangement with DynCorp or the other LOGCAP IV contractors.

    At issue, however, is whether DynCorp is billing the Government at any time for costs which they are not incurring by paying their employees. DCAA has done fine work on LOGCAP from day one of LOGCAP III. Unfortunately they have not had the resources to do complete audit work. One of the main audit issues consists of comparing work orders to time sheets to confirm that work shown on time sheets matches work performed. The validated time sheets should then match vouchers to the Government and payroll records of the employees. As you might imagine this is time consuming audit work, heavily dependent on the Contractor having validated and approved business systems.

    The other issue, as I noted earlier, concerns whether DynCorp is having performance issues due to this payroll problem. The Government should be taking action to correct any performance deficiencies.

  12. Comment by sonic:

    does dyncorp hires green card holder for logcap IV positions?

  13. Comment by dyncorp employee:

    The pay problems are still continuing on into March 2010. Now I’m hearing guys talk that their CIGNA insurance hasn’t been started yet. I’ve not checked mine as it’s been at home. TCN’s are the ones being hit the hardest. It’s insane as to whats happening. The DCMA’s and a couple of DCAA’s are very aware of the problem. I’m told that these issues are being worked, but, you just don’t know unless you’re in the know. So far my pay hasn’t been affected, but several co-employees I know still have not been paid. The Govt needs to get on the ball…

    • Comment by Ksniper:

      There heads are stuck in the sand when something bad happens God forbid the finger pointing will begin. Alas not KBR this time unless it spun. LOL

      • Comment by Ms Sparky:

        Dyncorp is Afghanistan is being run by a KBR reject Scott Mount and others. Do you realized how bad you have to screw up in order for KBR to fire a manager or give them a “not eligible” for rehire status. And evidently that makes them qualified to work for Dyncorp because they have some doozies!

        Speaking of DOOZIES…..Bill Walter KBR’s Director if Government Compliance is no longer working for KBR as of last week. Also…Senior Counsel Michael Hatch seems to be looking for employment as well (hello Dyncorp) anyway…..someone email me and fill me in. Don’t post it publicly.

    • Comment by Ms Sparky:

      This is unbelievable. I have yet to get one complaint about pay issues with Fluor on LOGCAP IV. I have never heard of a KBR employee going so long without being paid. If there was a error is was fixed ASAP. Although I loathe KBR Corporate I will give them KUDOS on making sure people got paid. I am going to contact the Mainstream Media and see of anyone is interested in a story on this…again. This is messed up and has to be costing the US taxpayer money for those people who are demobing because they don’t work for free!

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